Convert 351W to EFI or swap in 5.0 w/EFI?

[Bronco_Gino]

Fellow Bronco enthusiasts, I'm trying to decide how best to fuel inject my 74 Bronco. Currently, I've got a carbureted 351w. It's a fairly low-mileage engine, about a 1974 vintage, and I've been planning to install EFI on it over the winter. However, I just came across what seems like a great deal on a 1987 EFI 5.0 that will include everything from ECU to injectors. I can get the whole setup for around $800, and the engine is fairly low mileage, also. My question, of course, is should I stick with my windsor, and just piece together the EFI for it, or would I be better off just going back to a 302/5.0? I'd appreciate your inputs.

Thanks in advance,

- Gino

My Bronco:

1974 Bronco, D44(w/Detroit), Ford 9" (w/31spline Detroit), 35" MTRs, C-4 auto, Atlas II, cage, blah, blah, blah...

[Gunnibronco]

I'd say put that 5.0 in and I'll take that pesky 351 off your hands.

Really, I'd just add EFI to the 351, if the motor is good. I wouldn't go back to a 302, even if the 351 needed rebuilt, just my opinion. 351 is a better motor for the Bronco than the 302. I decided to put EFI on my stock 302, instead of swapping to a 5.0 because it is strong & the OBA, alt, p/s pump, & water pump all are good.

Chad

[Rox Crusher]

I am in the process of converting to EFI using a 5.0 Explorer motor.

I think your decision will be largely driven by the condition of the 5.0 you have found. Very few older 5.0 around that haven't been modified or abused in one way or another. So if you can trust that the guy who has it might be worth considering.

For that kind of money it should be in great shape and come with all the engine accessories and brackets, etc.

I am gonna run my 5.0 while I search for the perfect 5.8 to EFI sometime in the future.

[Entourage]

I am planning to add EFI to my 351 so I would be interested in which way you were going with your 351 EFI build.

[Gunnibronco]

I just talked to a guy with a machine shop here in Gunnison about building intake adapters. I've started a thread with some ideas & questions, here:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2877

Chad

[rtreads]

I have an intake adapter for sale...

[rtreads]

correction... i have the adapter for the truck lower and mustang upper for sale. Stick with that. It increases runner length, disapates heat from the upper intake, and has fewer gaskets to leak vs the intake adapter.

[Gunnibronco]

Good ideas rtreads, I'm moving my questions over to my thread, so we aren't hijacking this one.

[rtreads]

...good call. my bad

[airbur]

Keep your 351. I also wrestled with this delema before deciding on buying a 351w block. Here is a great article by a very well respected engine builder in CA that might help you decide.

http://www.badasscars.com/index.cfm/pag ... prd104.htm

The 5th paragraph is the meat. Granted....it's regarding strokers....but it has good info on the internals.

[Bronco_Gino]

Thanks, guys. I guess part of the issue is that I'm a bit lazy and it seems like it would be easier to just swap in the complete 302. However, I know my 351 is a strong motor, but I have no way of knowing how the 5.0 has been treated, so maybe I'm better off sticking with a known quantity. I guess what I need is a good list of all the parts I'll need to retrofit my windsor. Here are the parts I know I need to get from the junkyard:
351 Truck lower (w/injectors, fuel rails, bolts, etc.)
intake adapter
5.0 upper w/throttle body, mass air sensor
351 Truck distributor (which one do I need?)
Mass Air Computer
Low pressure fuel pump (new, or can I find these in a junkyard?)
High Pressure fuel pump (new, or can I find these in a junkyard?)
I'm planning to buy a wiring harness from fordfuelinjection.com (Is that a good idea? Do I need to do that?)

Questions:
What about my stock alternator? WIll that work?
What other ignition parts do I need?

Thanks in advance for your help!

- Gino

[Gunnibronco]

I'm adding EFI to my 5.0 in the next few weeks so I'll answer what I can.

The adapter comes from BC Broncos, you won't find one in a junk yard
http://www.bcbroncos.com/store/product_ ... ts_id=1059

The adapter uses a car, typically a MUstang upper, T-birds, Cougars, Lincoln Town Cars, Continentals, Crown Vics all had uppers that will work with the adapter, I think.

You need a dizzy with a cast iron gear if you have a hydraulic flat tappet camshaft. Steel gear if you are using a rollered camshaft. If you can only find a dizzy with the wrong gear, you'll have to get a new gear & change it, its possible. For 5.0s there are dizzys with the ignition control module (TFI) mounted to it, and dizzys with a remote mounted module, there are some differences in the wiring. The easy route to go is a dizzy w/TFI, but that may not exist for 351/5.8. The wire harness is built for a dizzy mounted TFI.

All the rest looks good. You can find a HP pump on late 80s trucks & vans, its commonly known as an E2000. You can use any electric lp pump suitable for a carb. You should probably add an accumulator between the pumps, also available from BC Broncos. Mass air computers can come from any 5.0 car with a mass air meter-many of the same cars the upper manifold can come from. There will be a SD or a MA in a code number on the sticker, indicating the type of computer. I just bought my computer from Advance Auto, rebuilt, 1 yr warranty ($85.00 + 45.00 core) if you have any problems finding one.

I'm about to order my wire harness from fordfuelinjection. The EFI guru on the board, Viperwolf1, recommends ordering an injector rebuild kit too, cheap insurance.

[Bronco_Gino]

Thanks, Gunni. I knew I wouldn't find the adapter in the junkyard. Guess I shouldn't have included it in the junkyard list. I will have to check the trucks I find to see what the dizzys look like in Windsors. Hopefully they have the TFI module mounted to it. What about a coil? Do I need one, or does the TFI module take the place of the coil?

What about sensors? Which ones do I need, and where on the donor vehicle are they located?

[Gunnibronco]

fordfuelinjection.com is the bible. Pics & source info are there. Its huge and intimidating, but plan on reading & rereading the whole thing.

The sensors are on most 5.0 vehicles, there are some differences in years, look at the "do you have the right parts" page linked from the RJM harness page.

Idle Air Control & Throttle Position Sensor, they are on the Throttle Body
Air Charge Temp, this will be in the air inlet tubing, filter area, or even in the lower intake manifold depending on the car
Engine Coolant Temp, this is in the lower intake manifold
Buy new O2 sensors
You want an inertia switch, that cuts off the fuel pump if you roll or are hit hard. They are all over vehicles in different places. Its a red button to push to reset.

You'll need a coil, that is one thing I forgot.

[airbur]

http://www.flatlanderracing.com/pmespacers-01.html

Not the best way to go in my opinion.

[Justin]

http://www.flatlanderracing.com/pmespacers-01.html

Not the best way to go in my opinion.

Why? Seems like a decent solution, other than having one more set of gaskets to leak.

Re: FI 5.0 vs. 351w EFI, what does your budget allow? I'd personally go with the 351w since its a known quantity. Torque and HP aside, reliability seems key to me in a truck that is going to get driven out to the middle of nowhere.

[Gunnibronco]

Bronco Gino, sorry for gumming up your thread with intake info you aren't looking for.

Here is the dizzy for the 351 w/cast gear & dizzy mounted TFI.

Cardone #302884 (you can get this as a rebuilt dizzy @ Rock Auto, or any regular parts store)

Lists 88-91 Bronco, F150, F250, F350 & E150. E250, & E350

Found it here:
http://fordfuelinjection.com/?p=89

Chad

[Bronco_Gino]

Thanks again, Chad. I'll check it out. I'm starting to look for parts now, so if anyone has EFI stuff they're looking to get rid of, let me know.

[Gunnibronco]

Good luck,

I think, I've accounted for everything to swap in my EFI soon. I'm just waiting on my harness & injector kit, due here Wed, and some stuff coming down "Special Delivery" from Denver on Thursday.

I was rereading the thread & above I forgot to mention you'll need a Barometric Pressure sensor, it looks a lot like a MAP sensor from a speed density system. You can see the difference on the fordfuelinjection.com web site. I found my BP sensor on a 4.0L V6 Explorer. It was tucked into a "cubbyhole" in the firewall above the motor, all you could see was the end of the sensor with the grey fitting.

Getting all the right parts can be tedious, so don't hesitate to ask questions, I'll try to help. I'm new to the EFI conversion (haven't actually done it), but I've been reading & thinking & accumulating parts for about 6-8 months now, so I think I've got a decent handle on the basics. There are lots of guys on here who can help if things get complicated or it doesn't run right. I don't think I can help with that yet.

Chad

[rtreads]

I was thinking of doing EFI on my blue bronco. For the orange one I just used a mustang harness and modified it. But I am interested in the harness you ordered.

[Gunnibronco]

I'm getting this one, because I'm going to move some stuff around, and am planning on rewiring my truck soon after installing EFI:
http://www.rjminjectiontech.com/collect ... al-harness

This is similar, but loomed & more finished:
http://www.rjminjectiontech.com/collect ... rd-harness

[RJLougee]

Keep your 351. I also wrestled with this delema before deciding on buying a 351w block. Here is a great article by a very well respected engine builder in CA that might help you decide.

http://www.badasscars.com/index.cfm/pag ... prd104.htm

The 5th paragraph is the meat. Granted....it's regarding strokers....but it has good info on the internals.

Excellent article. Also helps explain the engine in my sig line. Gotta love 500+ HP on regular gas. It's still not as fast as the Explorer 5.0 in the buggy, but it's not bad for a four seater.

Obviously, my vote would be on the 351W.

I've done several EFI conversions and have no issues using Chucks adapter. I like the aftermarket stuff if you need the engine to breathe more, but the adapter is fine for a 351W. Stay away from the multi-part gaskets/adapters, they are really hard to keep sealed. A buddy had the Price Motorsport adapter in his and couldn't keep it from developing a vacuum leak once or twice a year. He since replaced it with a GT-40 intake setup.
Joe

[Bronco_Gino]

Thanks all. I'm sure I'll have more questions as I go, but this gets me started in the right direction.