Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

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airbur
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Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Moved this post over here since it seemed like a good place to start...

Completed the teardown (save the valve body) of the 4R70W yesterday.

The guy I bought it from told me that "it's a builder as there's something wrong with it...and it doesn't shift right." Since I've never cracked open a tranny before, that scared me...as I had no idea what I'd be looking for. Well, talk about gratification...after a few hours of disassembly, I finally got to the innards, as I pulled out the front pump, I saw a metal shard fall out with it. Once I got the entire forward hub and clutch packs out, I found more damage....the shard had cracked off the clutch outer race and intermediate clutch hub and I think the reverse clutch drum assy is also damaged.

This was actually great news as I now know what needs to be replaced:) After a little research...it's apparent this is the part that the mechanical diode upgrade replaces. Looks like I'll be buying most of the parts Baumann offers... http://www.becontrols.com/products/aodecat.htm
I'm still under $450 for the entire thing with all the upgrades I plan along with the overhaul kit:) That doesn't include the controller of course, which will come later.

I found a place in Castle Rock that will hot-tank the case for me for free. I'll slip him a $20. Then it's cast-iron paint time.

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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Few more....

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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Gunnibronco »

I'm subscribing to watch this. I know jack crap about autos, but this is the trans I want in the future. Good luck, I hope your experience will help me make smart decisions in the future. I know your 427 build thread has already talked me out of trying that myself.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Gunnibronco »

I was just reading your post over at CB.com. You pointed out the need to upgrade to the mechanical diode if using an older 4R70W. I had also read that this was an important improvement Ford made. The article did not state that it could be upgraded. How much extra expense is it to make the upgrade? Just wondering, because, I'm keeping my eyes open for a deal, and wonder if its worth getting an early trans & updating it or just looking for a newer one with the mechanical diode.
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." ΓÇô Claire Wolfe
74-AWB 98", ZF5, Atlas4, HP609s, ARBs, 37's, 3.5" lift-5.5" front coil springs, Tahoe rear springs, EFI 302, h-boost, 4x4x2 hyrdo assist, custom dash & gauges
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Yea...1998+ model years had the mechanical diode already. That might be worth looking for. I picked up this tranny for only $100 since it was busted...just nice it turned out to be the same part I will upgrade. The mechanical diodes run around $150 for all 3 pieces.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Gunnibronco »

Thanks,

I was just planning on ruling out anything pre-98, but that is not too much money if I can find a good enough deal. Since I'd probably have the trans rebuilt (or possibly do it myself), a couple hundred extra wouldn't break the bank. That is good news, because finding a 4R70W in Gunnison is going to be hard enough, let alone waiting to find the right year. Its such a long term plan, I've got lots of time to look, so hopefully I'll stumble on one with all the good stuff.
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." ΓÇô Claire Wolfe
74-AWB 98", ZF5, Atlas4, HP609s, ARBs, 37's, 3.5" lift-5.5" front coil springs, Tahoe rear springs, EFI 302, h-boost, 4x4x2 hyrdo assist, custom dash & gauges
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Here are the two manuals I am using. So far they have been awesome. The first one is all about the AODE and has complete step by step tear down and build up instructions. The second is an update manual for the 4R70W with lots of issues and how to diagnose and fix them (including the suggested mechanical diode upgrade).

http://atsg.com/cart/products/AODE_4R70W-48-6.html

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http://atsg.com/cart/products/AODE_4R70 ... -78-6.html

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I also bought their 4R70W DVD but I'm not sold on it yet. It's only about 45min long and isn't to detailed. There are clips you can watch on YouTube and the quality isn't that great.

http://atsg.com/cart/products/Ford_AOD_ ... 59-16.html
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Dropped it off at the tranny shop in Castle Rock yesterday for a cleaning, they had it done and dry in an hour. He mentioned that they could ream and sleeve the governor bore for $100 bucks and I said thanks and I'd consider it. My first thought was he was just trying to get $ out of me so I came home and did a little research. Turns out that this actually is a good idea as this bore tends to get larger with mileage and then starts leaking...causing failure. I looked up the tool to do it myself and it's $500! (http://www.etoolcart.com/governorboreca ... -aode.aspx) Since I'm not planning on becoming the Viperwolf1 of 4R70Ws, I may take it back down and see if they'll do it for a bit less than $100....It will probably take them 20 minutes to do it and I know the sleeve is only $15 retail. (http://www.etoolcart.com/replacementsle ... 95-sl.aspx)

I brought the case home and put 2 coats of high-zinc primer on it. Next will be a few coats of cast iron paint.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Primer....
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by rtreads »

Speaking of viper.....?

We should all pitch in and buy him the tools needed to rebuild 4R70W units. I'm sure we all can keep him busy. ...I have a viper built C4 now.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Gunnibronco »

rtreads wrote:Speaking of viper.....?

We should all pitch in and buy him the tools needed to rebuild 4R70W units. I'm sure we all can keep him busy. ...I have a viper built C4 now.



+1
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Haha....I agree!

Fyi...this is by far the best article for general info and builder parts on the 4R70W I have found. On page 12 there is a nice writeup also on how to pressure lubricate the rear extension bushing. http://www.tccoa.com/articles/tranny/tr ... ndex.shtml

I believe this is what the setup looks like....

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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by akaFrankCastle »

rtreads wrote:Speaking of viper.....?

We should all pitch in and buy him the tools needed to rebuild 4R70W units. I'm sure we all can keep him busy. ...I have a viper built C4 now.


I was thinking with all of the Super Dutys in the club, the 4R100 would be a better next evolution for Viper. icon biggin
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Rox Crusher »

airbur wrote:Haha....I agree!

Fyi...this is by far the best article for general info and builder parts on the 4R70W I have found. On page 12 there is a nice writeup also on how to pressure lubricate the rear extension bushing. http://www.tccoa.com/articles/tranny/tr ... ndex.shtml

I believe this is what the setup looks like....

Image


Based on that pic, I think you just found your long lost brother !

My work area is reasonably tidy but you guys got it going on !

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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Haha..that's funny! I can't handle disorganization. I tend to lose parts and a messy work area makes them disappear into thin air!
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Got it painted today and the valve body disassembled a bit...I marked the check ball locations with screws for the picture before I removed them.

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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Rox Crusher »

airbur wrote:Haha..that's funny! I can't handle disorganization. I tend to lose parts and a messy work area makes them disappear into thin air!


I never LOSE parts.....................but sometimes they don't show up until long after I put something back together

banghead

looking good !
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

I swear that I've watched small parts roll off my bench and disappear into thin air before the hit the ground...literally!
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by ClayJ »

An old proverb says:

"Take something apart and put it back together enough times, and soon you will have enough parts for 2 of them"
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by socofn »

Vragor wrote:An old proverb says:

"Take something apart and put it back together enough times, and soon you will have enough parts for 2 of them"




I did not know you had watched me put something back together!! loco JP
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Talk about small parts. I just disassembled my iPhone 4 to replace the shattered front glass....that tiny line of parts next to the screens are little itty-bitty screws and washers.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

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airbur wrote:Talk about small parts. I just disassembled my iPhone 4 to replace the shattered front glass....that tiny line of parts next to the screens are little itty-bitty screws and washers.


My Boss's iPhone 4 slid off his hood onto the garage floor and cracked the glass. It was 8 months old and he hadn't bought the insurance. He took it to the apple store ready to pay for a new iphone or glass replacement or something. The guy he talked to switched his iPhone for a new one and didn't charge him anything. He even transferred all of the data to the new phone.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Yea...tried that but since this is a 4 and the new ones are the 4S...they wouldn't swap it out:(
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Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Called that tranny shop and the owner said $50 to sleeve the bore so I'll drop it off tomorrow.

I need to pickup a parts washer for all the internals. Any suggestions on a good cleaner to use? I think viper mentioned he uses mineral spirits.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by Rox Crusher »

Mineral spirits work great as long as you don't get the environmentally watered down kind.
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Rox Crusher wrote:Mineral spirits work great as long as you don't get the environmentally watered down kind.


Where can you get this stuff in bulk? Depot?
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

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airbur wrote:
Rox Crusher wrote:Mineral spirits work great as long as you don't get the environmentally watered down kind.


Where can you get this stuff in bulk? Depot?


Price shop Ace and Home Depot
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Re: Airbur's (attempt at a) 4R70W Rebuild

Post by airbur »

Does it come in 5gal drums?
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