Thoughts on gas tanks

[Gunnibronco]

The tank arrived this afternoon, right on schedule. Really it came quicker than I thought. The skid plate is welded directly to the bottom of the tank, it is not an extra piece like I expected. I wish I had them add an extra return, so I could plumb my transfer pump to the tank. I'm going to use a T fitting I bought from BCB that fits the 5/8" vent line, so its not a big deal. I had planned to use that T as the return, if I was using the 66-70 tank I had POR'd. No fittings for venting or evap systems. I bet they would add them, I thought it would come on the tank since I ordered it for a 74. I stripped my evap system years ago, so I don't need it.

I have a dumb question, this tank is supposed to be built for an intank EFI pump. I'm going to stick with my external pumps & accumulator for a little while, and add the internal pump at a later date. I cannot figure how you'd go about installing the internal pump. The pick up is at the bottom of the tank. How do you attach a hose/pump to the pick up? Does the pump fit through the sending unit hole? The sending unit barely fits.

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[Rox Crusher]

Rut-roh

The BC tank has a baffle system that the pump mounts to by way of a plastic mounting clamp.

The "pick-up tube" is just an inlet built into the bottom of the pump which has a filter over it.

A rubber fuel hose, rated for submersion in fuel, is connected to the top of the pump and to the bottom of the pick-up tube.

The BC. Tank has a much larger opening for getting your arm in there to do the mounting and make the connections.

Oh well, external mounted pumps work well too.

In fact, if mine weren't already the in-tank style.........I would go with the external pump. I didn't want to re-do my fuel lines etc

[Gunnibronco]

That sucks. I think you are right. Ill call/email them, but I dont think they will be open till Monday. I really want my truck running soon.

Really screwed me because I just returned a Carter low press pump to summit. I was going to upgrade the low press pump, but since I was going to end up with an internal pump I sent it back.

Im going to hook up my aux tank just to get the truck running and see if aero will send me the right tank. We specifically spoke about the pump mount on the phone. Im pretty sure I paid extra for it.

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[Gunnibronco]

Ive been thinking about this situation. I can get the truck running on the aux tank pretty easily.

I could ask for a credit for the pump bracket I did not receive. Or I could get a new tank built and sent, the way I ordered it.

Is the in tank pump that much more reliable? Changing the frame mount pumps is easier, in the case of failure.

Any opinions on which system is best?

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[Rox Crusher]

I think there are a lot of benefits to the external pump, especially when troubleshooting.

I don't know the application but a couple guys are using a Ford EFI pump that was mounted on the frame under the driver's seat. Hopefully they will post up about it.

The benefit of having them redo the tank would be that they could ad the missing vent and return tubes.

[Jesus_man]

I have a Holley red LP pump mounted externally right off the tank, then the factory HP pump in the engine bay. My LP fuel pump is audible, but once the engine is running, you can't hear it. My exhaust is not the quietest either.

Never had an internal setup, but once I figured out that I was getting water in my LP pump relay and remedied that, I haven't had a lick of trouble with my setup. I probably need to rebuild the Holley, but it keeps humming along.

Like Rox said, if you have trouble, at least you won't have to drop the tank to R&R the pump. The fuel does keep them cooler, but external pumps are designed not to need that cooling effect. And the fuel line rated for submersion isn't cheap, is fairly hard to find and still deteriorates. Ask all the XJ guys. Have two cousins who wheel them and had a heck of a time finding out what was wrong with their jeeps only to find the hose rotted and was sucking air and pieces of hose into the system. Many more horror stories out there to the point where that's the first place most people look now.

J.D.

[Gunnibronco]

I like the serviceability of the external pumps. Im running the factory high press pump like Rox mentioned, and an unknown low pressure pump. I think it is the one BC Broncos sells, but purchased from Carquest, probably. I was going to upgrade to a Carter low pressure pump.

JD thanks for the vote of confidence on the external pumps. I was a little afraid of long term reliability.

I don't need the extra fittings. I can add them as needed. Reliability is my main concern. I guess the external pumps and accumulator seem somewhat exposed and prone to damage from rocks and stuff. Nothing a couple small shields wouldn't take care of.

Thanks guys.

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[Gunnibronco]

Here are the pics that matter. I'm guessing I'll just get refunded for the internal tank pump stuff I didn't get and continue running external pumps. I'm not doing anything permanent till I talk to Aero.

Anyways, I tried to dryfit the tank on Friday, but it was just interfering with the rear of my receiver. So today I clearanced the receiver. Thank you plasma! It was so easy, only used 110v, but it was pretty sweet. Cut through 1/4" pretty easy. Can't wait to get the garage inspected and 220 on.

Here is how the tank fits. There is a little room above the tank, if it went up any higher, you couldn't get the filler neck hose on. I have some 1/2"+ thick rubber mat I'm hoping will fit.

[Jesus_man]

Looks tucked up in there pretty good!!

I ended up putting some 1/2" x 1" pieces of wood above my tank to keep it from rubbing the body. Not as fancy as rubber, but it's worked well.

[Gunnibronco]

Hoping to talk to Aero Tanks, and get this resolved today. After I talk to them, I should be able to install the tank. I have everything set & ready.

[Gunnibronco]

Aerotanks just called and said they are making me a new tank and shipping it asap.

You can't ask for better service than that.

Its nice they returned my call, within 40 minutes of opening this morning, and had a very satisfatory solution already in progress. Mistakes happen to all companies, its the good ones who fix them, no questions asked.

[Jesus_man]

Do you have to send the old tank back??

[Gunnibronco]

He said, "We'll worry about getting the wrong tank back, later."

Don't know what that means, but.... I'm sure he'd rather not pay to ship the tank back. If he doesn't just leave it with me, I'm sure he'd be open to offers.

[Jesus_man]

That'd be very tempting. Even to have on the shelf for when I get real worried about mine leaking...

[Friday]

Sounds like Aero is a very good company to work with. If they want to sell the tank you have and not mess with shipping let me know, I may be interested.

[Gunnibronco]

The tank arrived today. Obviously, they had left the pump hanger component off the first tank. I can see why there is a price difference.

Hope to get it installed over the next few evenings.

[Gunnibronco]

Is regular rubber gas hose ok to put into a gas tank?

I need to extend the pickup to the bottom of the tank until I get an internal pump. The guy at Aero said normal gas hose was ok. I was under the impression people were having problems with some hose inside the tank.

[Jesus_man]

No, it's not. As Rox mentioned somewhere along the way, there is special line required for an application where the fuel will be in contact with the inside and outside.

http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?broch ... ion_id=541

If you use normal fuel line, it will rot and clog fuel filters, or get holes and suck air.

[Gunnibronco]

I had a 3/8" steel line made that I thought I would solder to the 3/8" feed line, but its stainless. I just learned that you can't solder stainless.

I thought about using a 2 part epoxy there are some that are resistant to gasoline. Aero recommends using Devcon 5min epoxy to seal the sending unit ring.

I probably should just break down and get an intank pump.

[Eck]

There are a couple of different products that "patch" leaks on gas tanks and I'd think you could use that but that would probably be permanent. I'm guessing you are going to want to remove that when the in tank pump goes in.

[Gunnibronco]

I thought about the epoxy repair patch stuff & regular 2 part epoxy. I was worried about having it fail, more than being permanent. I think it could be removed when an in tank pump was installed, but the point is moot. I gave up, and decided to run to the parts store and order an intank pump. I even stripped my old external pumps & accumulator off the frame. Then I started fitting the new tank to weld on the support hangers.

The way the intank pump tank is built, the return lines are on top of the tank. I had to space the tank down about 1" to clear the fittings from the floor. With the tank spaced down, the fill neck was sitting on my frame. I don't think a rubber fill hose could have been attached. My body mounts are pretty smashed, if they were new or if I had a body lift, the tank would fit fine. I was surprised that they didn't recess the pump hanger into the top of the tank 1" like they did the sending unit.

Basically, I gave up on the intank pump tank, and fit the external pump tank. I'll put the pumps & accumulator back in.

I really couldn't be more frustrated. First my POR job failed on the used stock tank, then I order a new tank, get the wrong one, then wait on the right one, then the right one doesn't fit, then back to the "wrong" tank.

[Jesus_man]

Sorry Chad. You're sorta blazing your own trail here. So if it's any consolation, you'll be the resident expert...

[Gunnibronco]

Yeah, I've just made the wrong choices through this whole thing. After waiting 2 weeks, I can't believe the internal pump tank won't fit. Of course I spent 1/2 the day yesterday trying, unsuccessfully, to extend a pick up line, and then pulled my old pumps & accumulator out BEFORE test fitting the new tank.

I'm happy with the fit of the tank. I've built the hangers so I can add up to a 2" body lift (plus 1/2" to account for smashed bodymounts)I just need things running by Friday PM so I can leave for hunting camp.

I do think I found a better way to mount their tank. They recommend fishing bolts into the frame and down through holes in the rear crossmemeber. The holes in the crossmember have a matching hole in the top of the crossmember, so I used all thread.

I'll post up pics tonight hopefully, tomorrow for sure.

[Gunnibronco]

Here is the new EFI tank. The pump hanger/feed/return should have been recessed into the tank like the sending unit.

P1010973.JPG

Got the sending unit in, and the tank hung yesterday.

Here it is all painted & ready to install

P1010971.JPG

I used some left overs from my cage to build spacers. I'm ready for anything up to 2" BL. It hangs about 6" +/- from the bottom of the frame. I ran 1/2" all thread through the frame for the front 2 hangers. They said to fish bolts into those holes. I think I would have spent 1 day just trying to get bolts in. Then how are you going to get a wrench on them to tighten the bolts?

P1010974.JPG

P1010976.JPG

[Jesus_man]

Nice! You said it hangs below the frame about 6" eh? Hmm I wonder how far mine hangs down??

The allthread was a good idea!

[Gunnibronco]

Everything is in and its running.

I had a full 5 gallon plastic gas can I emptied into the new tank. I ran it a little to check for leaks. Everything looked ok and I drove 2 blocks to the gas station. The tank took another 15.7 gallons. So I've got a 20.7 gallon tank. Here are some pics with more specific measurements. I'm curious how the 23 gallon tanks compare.

4" from the frame at the rear of the tank

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6" from the frame at the bend, right below the stock tank hanger hole

P1010979.JPG

7" at the front of the tank

P1010980.JPG

[Gunnibronco]

So this isn't to do with my gas tank, but I'll post it up here.

I had to reroute the filler neck due to my Silverback flares. I ended up just cutting off the stock neck and finding a 90 bend the same diameter as the neck. Then I cut the reducer section of the stock neck out and clamped it to the 90 and to the smaller hose that connects to the tank. I cut off more before I was finished. It worked out really well. I just used some 5/8" fuel line to connect the breather to the neck. I also used a 5/8 to 3/8 barb in the breather to route the aux tank fill line. I'll post up pics of the finished product. It might be after hunting season, we'll see.

P1010983.JPG

I also replaced my accumulator with a smaller one, and raised it higher under the body. The result is the bottom of the filter is even with the bottom of the frame. This is not the small filter sold by BCB but a different one I found on the Fram crossreference site.

P1010982.JPG

[Jesus_man]

I am sure that feels good Chad! Now go get some meat!

[Kinder]

Congrats Chad, that was a long drawn out upgrade, good luck on the hunt.

[Rox Crusher]

Glad it finally all came together for you.

Way to persevere !